FURTHER CORRESPONDENCES BY MARC SUSSELMAN PART 6
11 October 2023
Marc Susselman said:
Link to an article by an Egyptian American writer condemning Hamas’s actions:
"News Article by Magazine..."
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Michael said:
I wrote this:
"Bombing the city of Gaza with tons & tons of pork juices will demoralize the terrorists in Gaza. For they might declare the city of Gaza as unclean & do whatever they can to escape from Gaza--even a mass surrender to the Israeli forces."
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MS said:
Israel’s objective is to eradicate Hamas at the same time that it minimizes the death/injury of Palestinian civilians who do not support Hamas. Even if pork is used to persuade the latter to want to leave Gaza, they have to have someplace to go. But neither Egypt nor Israel will allow them to escape into their country, because unless there is a way to differentiate Palestinians who support Hamas from those who don’t, just allowing Palestinians entry who wish to avoid pork will risk creating a 5th column within that country, which will threaten its security. Israel does not want to evacuate Gaza; it wants to rid Gaza of all Hamas elements, and leave the rest of the Palestinians in Gaza. This is not going to be accomplished without a lot of bloodshed, of Palestinians who support Hamas; those who do not support Hamas, and Israeli soldiers.
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12 October 2023
Michael said in response to David Z:
But why? Are you kidding? You could end the siege of Gaza, and not have to continue the bombing of Gaza with conventional munitions. The U.S. Air Force could do it. It may be unclean but more lives will be saved on both sides. All a Muslim needs to do to become clean again is to do an ablution. But with Gaza streets and roofs saturated with pork juices the Muslims may want to quickly flee. And all a Jewish gentleman (or IDF soldier) needs to do to become clean again is to follow the Torah by immersing in water, washing his clothes, and not being clean until nightfall.
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MS said:
Steve,
Congratulations on your retort to Mr. Pillette.
Someone should ask Mr. Pillette, since it is not feasible for every human being to be an entrepreneur and own their own business; nor be a farmer and grow their own food; nor be a carpenter and build their own shelter; nor be a weaver and make their own clothing, how are all these people supposed to feed, shelter, and clothe themselves and their families without selling their labor to the corrupt capitalist entrepreneur?
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14 October 2023
MS wrote:
The blood of the innocent German civilians – who did not support the Nazis, and did not vote for the Nazis to govern Germany - who died during the bombing and invasion of Germany during WWII is on the hands of the Allies.
The Allies should have waited until the Nazis surrendered before they invaded or bombed Germany. This would have prevented the collateral damage of innocent German civilians dying.
Germany was an open- air prison for the innocent German civilians.
There can be no moral ambiguity here.
There is only moral certainty - that those who oppose aggression must do so without causing the death of any who are not the aggressors.
Israel, as horrific as Hamas’s massacre of Israeli men, women and children was, must avoid the death of innocent Palestinian civilians, at all cost.
Israel should not respond to the rockets being fired into Israel by Hamas, because doing so leaves Gaza in rubble, and results in the death of innocent Palestinians.
Israel should wait until Hamas surrenders; or until Hamas no longer occupies Gaza.
This is the only moral thing to do, and we who are moral wish to maintain our moral purity.
If before this occurs, Israel invades Gaza and innocent Palestinian civilians die, their blood will be on the hands of the Israelis.
As the esteemed moral pundit Nicholas Kristoff wrote in the NYT, answering a war crime with aggression which results in the death of innocent civilians is itself a war crime. This is self-evident, and there should be no moral ambiguity here.
After all, it is the Israelis who started all this by declaring their independence in 1948, after the Palestinians and Arabs rejected the UN partition plan, which the Jews accepted.
After all, the failure to reach a two-state solution is primarily the fault of the Israelis, despite their multiple attempts from 1973-2020 to reach a peaceful resolution with the Palestinians.
After all, it is the Israelis who have made the two-state solution impracticable by continuing to build settlements on Palestinian land, despite Ehud Barak’s agreement at the 2000 Camp David accords to grant the Palestinians almost everything they were demanding, but which Yassir Arafat rejected, and would not agree to ceasing hostilities if a settlement accord were reached.
After all, it is the fault of the Israelis that the Hamas Charter calls for the destruction and annihilation of Israel.
And we who do not live in Israel have the right to condemn Israel for the death of innocent Palestinian civilians, who will not themselves condemn the atrocities committed by Hamas, because, of course, we wish to maintain our moral purity.
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Michael said:
There are three groups of people who make up a nation or state.
(1) Policy Makers, who have the most power.
(2) Operators, who enforce the orders & laws of the Policy Makers.
&
(3) Civilians, who have the least power
--In wars throughout the Middle East, Policy Makers
almost always suffer the least although they do the most mischief
& they are the smallest population of the state.
--Operators suffer less than Civilians but
more than Policy Makers. They do the majority
of Dirty Work of the Policy Makers. There are also more
Operators than there are Policy Makers, but
there are more Civilians than both.
--And it is Civilians who do the least evil out of all the three
classes of people in a nation or state.
Yet they receive the least respect, concern, sympathy,
& fame-and-glory of all the members that make a nation or state.
And yet in the Middle East conflicts they suffer the most out
of everyone else.
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15 October 2023
MS said:
On what basis do I assert that Jerremy Corbyn is a known anti-Semite?
“At a meeting hosted by Stop the War Coalition in 2009, Corbyn said he invited "friends" from Hamas and Hezbollah to an event in parliament, referred to Hamas as "an organisation dedicated towards the good of the Palestinian people," and said that the British government's labelling of Hamas as a terrorist organisation is "a big, big historical mistake."[436] Asked on Channel 4 News in July 2015 why he had called representatives from Hamas and Hezbollah "friends", Corbyn explained, "I use it in a collective way, saying our friends are prepared to talk," and that the specific occasion he used it was to introduce speakers from Hezbollah at a Parliamentary meeting about the Middle East. He said that he does not condone the actions of either organisation: "Does it mean I agree with Hamas and what it does? No. Does it mean I agree with Hezbollah and what they do? No. What it means is that I think to bring about a peace process, you have to talk to people with whom you may profoundly disagree … There is not going to be a peace process unless there is talks involving Israel, Hezbollah and Hamas and I think everyone knows that", he argued.”
At the time that Corbyn referred to Hamas as “friends,” the Hamas Charter called for the categorical destruction and annihilation of Israel. Hamas’s hatred of Israelis did not just emerge on October 7. Some friends.
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MS said:
Steve,
I find your most recent comment on Prof. Wolff’s blog rather astounding. Prof. Wolff has frequently stated that on issues of politics and ethics, one must decide “on which side you are on.” You have frequently commented in agreement with this perspective. Yet today you distinguish between “taking a side” and “taking a position,” and assert that “taking a position” is the more “mature” of the two. Why suddenly your conversion, when the subject has become the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, so that “taking a side,” for example in support of Israel, is now less mature?
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MS said:
THE WASHINGTON BEACON
By Andrew Kerr
(OCTOBER 10, 2023 / FREEBEACON)
Black Lives Matter Grassroots threw its support behind Hamas in a statement Monday evening, calling the terrorist group’s indiscriminate murder of Israeli citizens over the weekend a "desperate act of self-defense."
The group, which represents 26 local Black Lives Matters chapters across the country, said it had no choice but to "stand unwaveringly on the side of the oppressed" and support "Palestine" after Hamas terrorists invaded Israel, killing over 1,000 Israelis and 11 Americans and injuring thousands more.
"As Black people continue the fight to end militarism and mass incarceration in our own communities, let us understand the resistance in Palestine as an attempt to tear down the gates of the world’s largest open air prison," BLM Grassroots said. "As a radical Black organization grounded in abolitionist ideals, we see clear parallels between Black and Palestinian people."
BLM Grassroots echoed statements from "Squad" members Rep. Rashida Tlaib (D., Mich.) and Rep. Cori Bush (D., Mo.), saying the only way to ensure peace in the region is to cut Israel off from U.S. military aid.
"For lasting peace to come, the entire apartheid system must be dismantled," BLM Grassroots said. "The war on the Palestinian people must cease. We call on the United States government to immediately stop funding war and redirect the $4 billion in annual spending to repair the damage caused by U.S.-backed wars, military air strikes, coups, and destabilizing interventions against oppressed people around the world."
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MS said:
Suzanne Sommers, the mystical blonde in the Thunderbird in George Lucas's first great movie, "American Graffiti." has passed away, age 76. Do not ask for whom the bell tolls ....
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16 October 2023
MS said:
I love it. Barney Wolff putting his cousin in his place by quoting Einstein.
He could have also included this quotation of Einstein: "To punish me for my contempt of authority, Fate has made me an authority myself."
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MS said:
Post-script:
In 1938, after Einstein had emigrated from Europe to the United States in 1921, but before the Holocaust, he stated in a speech: “My awareness of the essential nature of Judaism resists the idea of a Jewish state with borders, an army, and a measure of temporal power.”
He changed his mind when the horrors of the Holocaust became known after WWII, and supported the creation of a Jewish state in Palestine, but declined Israel’s offer for him to be President.
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17 October 2023
Michael said:
In Deuteronomy 6:10-15, there is talk of a place
where the Jewish people will go to take root
& never leave. This specific place is not
The Holy Land, in my view, but rather The
Promised Land. A place where many righteous
people will go, but where there will be
urban-cordons where only the Jews & others
(each to his own)
etc can inhabit.
Here is the text:
Deuteronomy 6:10-15
10 And it shall be, when the Lord thy God shall have brought thee into the land which he sware unto thy fathers, to Abraham, to Isaac, and to Jacob, to give thee great and goodly cities, which thou buildedst not,
11 And houses full of all good things, which thou filledst not, and wells digged, which thou diggedst not, vineyards and olive trees, which thou plantedst not; when thou shalt have eaten and be full;
12 Then beware lest thou forget the Lord, which brought thee forth out of the land of Egypt, from the house of bondage.
13 Thou shalt fear the Lord thy God, and serve him, and shalt swear by his name.
14 Ye shall not go after other gods, of the gods of the people which are round about you;
15 (For the Lord thy God is a jealous God among you) lest the anger of the Lord thy God be kindled against thee, and destroy thee from off the face of the earth.
--Of course I don't think in this portion of the
text Moses is talking about the United States nor
Israel. In the Torah, God gives the land West of
the Euphrates & up to the Eastern Mediterranean shore
to the Israelites. But the above portion of
the Deuteronomy text quoted I believe is held
in a different context from the physical land
boundaries mentioned in the rest of the Torah concerning Jews in the Middle East area.
Jesus mentions a Second Flood of the Earth.
And if there is a Second (but not global) Flood, there must be
a Second Noah (the Jewish Messianic Prophecies talk about
this future unknown prophet, which are the prophecies not about Jesus).
And, of course, a Second Ark is in the biblical details as well. This
is a place of refuge spoken in the Book of Revelation
3:7-13.
--So whatever anyone may believe, the Jewish people have never
entered a promised land of "perfection" mentioned in Deuteronomy
6:10-15. The entire world seems to be converging unto this
place & time with great prophetic haste. And although many
Jews, Christians, & Muslims probably will make it to this 2nd Ark, or
Elysium, sadly many will be Left Behind on Earth of course.
And although many may call this unfair, just remember that Noah could
only save a few of his family members from the devastating flood.
This time around God may save over a billion souls from the ravages of
Comet Wormwood mentioned in Revelation.
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The End.